Evolv DNA Forum
Sign up Calendar Latest Topics
 
 
 


Reply
  Author   Comment   Page 3 of 7      Prev   1   2   3   4   5   6   Next   »
350ZMO

Junior Member
Registered:
Posts: 4
Reply with quote  #31 
I'm in the both-option-not only camp.

Although the 200 seems smoother for whatever reason, I still get the best vape experience when I set watts just under the setting at which TP kicks in. EG right now on a .18 NI200 build in a GT2 and set Temp to 360F power to 24W on this build and juice shows real time temp fluctuating around 300F. Then set 200W and temp to 280F, 290F...320F respectively keeping everything else the same. Try it with your numbers and see which you prefer.

Not saying why. Not saying good or bad. I will just say I find the vape experience in real life practice is different and different people will prefer different things and that's just peachy.

If you haven't tried this test then I suggest trying it to decide which you like. One test is worth a thousand opinions but you wont know which you like until you try them.

Then try it with different attys to see if your preference changes.

Many valid reasons to pick either method.

When these devices give me the same vape experience in real life practice with either method and all my attys, then it won't matter. Until then, it matters to me.
VapingBad

Avatar / Picture

Administrator
Registered:
Posts: 2,449
Reply with quote  #32 
After watching this (35 mins) many people will see this feature as making it too complicated if it is a default, no reason it should be an option for enthusiasts, but as it is you can just set the temp and hand it to your grandpa telling him just use up, down and fire and stick to Kanthal, Nichrome & Ni200 coils it is a very easy device to use.

__________________
• I am not employed by nor do I represent Evolv Inc.  All opinions are my own, they are just opinion not fact and can be wrong •

Latest versions of EScribe: DNA 200/250DNA 75
Common problems
Dejay

Member
Registered:
Posts: 44
Reply with quote  #33 
I would absolutely love this feature. I want to experiment more with temperature to find a sweet spot but as it is I'm often too lazy to play around with it. Please add it soon - it's the one feature I'm really missing from the amazing DNA 200! [smile]

The somewhat "religious war" around the question if we vape temperature controlled or temperature limited is a little bit amusing [smile] I think one reason why some people like "TL" and set watts low is to create a slowly heating vape. Me I just want full on vapor instantly. But if you set wattage low then you also have to disable pre-heat? Else I don't see how it makes a big difference since the pre heat boosts the watts anyways to reach temperature asap.

I'd love if someone who prefers this TL style would post two screenshots of the vaping / temperature / power graph of the device monitor. I'm genuinely curious!

BTW I think temp control makes vaping actually easier to set up for grandmas. Just set to 420°F and done.
VapingBad

Avatar / Picture

Administrator
Registered:
Posts: 2,449
Reply with quote  #34 
"religious war" bit OTT.

Both ways ultimatly adjust power, I keep the temp set for flavour, but am usually at the temp limit because my ADV is a genny, but on a dripper with more room and airflow I still keep at the same temp and adjust the watts & airflow.  And I always have the preheat punch at max normally for 1.5 seconds, 200 W on cotton, but anywhere between 80 W and 150 W on gennnies as until the mesh oxidises more with age you are at risk of shorts and on some builds you can burn through a leg at 200 W.

This has pre heat 100W, punch 11, time limit 1.5 s, time scale 10 sec.
 

dm tmp02.jpg 

ETA the pre-heat is even more important/effective running below the temp limit than running at temp.

No pre-heat needed running at temp, pre-heat turned off just using the temp limit to control everything which is fine, just addressing the previous posters point on pre-heat.
dm tmp04.jpg 


__________________
• I am not employed by nor do I represent Evolv Inc.  All opinions are my own, they are just opinion not fact and can be wrong •

Latest versions of EScribe: DNA 200/250DNA 75
Common problems
blueridgedog

Avatar / Picture

Moderator
Registered:
Posts: 573
Reply with quote  #35 
VapingBad:  I finally have an atomizer that I have to use in the mode you cover...the new Aromamizer...nice tank.  Not one you want to attempt to adjust with temp settings.
Dejay

Member
Registered:
Posts: 44
Reply with quote  #36 
Thanks @VapingBad for posting the graphs!

And sorry lol but there are some discussions where some people correct other people saying that the DNA only does temperature limiting and not temperature control and that it's totally wrong one way or another. Not trying to start something here but trying to understand! And imho your graph shows that the DNA can do both and that they are different. 

Those graphs seem to show that the temperature "reacts" to how you vape. So if you draw a bit slower the temp gets hotter and if you draw more forcefully the temp gets lower and you get those bumps in the temp curve. That means it should be a different experience. Maybe the difference between a more "organic" vape (Temperature limiting - vaping on a glowing ember) or vaping more digital (temperature control - vaping on a high tech machine). This might also depend on how homogeneously the atomizer's chimney and drip top you are using is cooling the vapor.

PS: Of course I still very much prefer the temperature control approach and would love an option to change temp with + and - buttons directly [wink]
VapingBad

Avatar / Picture

Administrator
Registered:
Posts: 2,449
Reply with quote  #37 
Thanks
I say temp limiting as it only technically limits the max temp, maybe being pedantic, but in my line of work being loose with technical terms can cause mistakes through miscommunication and being precise is part of the discipline. I often vape on the limit at a constant temp, I just don't use the temp to adjust vapour production as I match the temp to the liquid I use for flavour.

__________________
• I am not employed by nor do I represent Evolv Inc.  All opinions are my own, they are just opinion not fact and can be wrong •

Latest versions of EScribe: DNA 200/250DNA 75
Common problems
stuartro

Member
Registered:
Posts: 35
Reply with quote  #38 
I, too, would like to be able to control temperature (instead of power) without having to lock, press and hold + and -, adjust temperature, and then unlock again.

In TC "mode" (yes, I know there are no distinct "modes"), it makes sense (to me, at least) to have the + and - buttons adjust temperature, and have the "lock, hold + and -" thing adjust power. While when running in non TC "mode" have the + and - buttons adjust power.
Margucci

Senior Member
Registered:
Posts: 117
Reply with quote  #39 
semantics aside, this proposed change seems like a no brainer. there should be a way to not only change the power but also the temperature from the device itself. i know that depending on the juice i am using to like to change both. i personally dont know why evolv stuck with the same UI (essentially) as the DNA40. with all the added potential of the 200 even something like a limited menu based UI should have been a given. or perhaps bluetooth with a phone app in a future v2 chip release so we can change things on the go.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartro
In TC "mode" (yes, I know there are no distinct "modes"), it makes sense (to me, at least) to have the + and - buttons adjust temperature, and have the "lock, hold + and -" thing adjust power. While when running in non TC "mode" have the + and - buttons adjust power.

that is an amazing idea. 
lewisss

Senior Member
Registered:
Posts: 139
Reply with quote  #40 
just going to throw my two penneth in!

I started the other thread asking for this feature , and I never asked for it to be a default.
just to have the option to change it!.

I am almost exclusively using SS on a dripper and I have noticed a strange anomaly with this material.

brand new coil and 320 F at 60 W is about right, after a few puffs i need to increase the temp

to 380 to get the same experience.

after a day 400 at 60w gives the same vape and after a few days it requires 420-440F again at 60 w

Now changing the power does not affect the vape as normally the temp control will limit the power any way.

during this time the resistance of the coil remains constant.

SO my theory is that SS (or at least the one i am using) actually changes its heat coeficient the more times it is heated and cooled. 

therefore I would like to again say that the OPTION to have Temp as the easiest one to change and the main display would be a good idea.


My next post here is going to be controversial!
lewisss

Senior Member
Registered:
Posts: 139
Reply with quote  #41 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bapgood
How I recall it being explained to me is:


Short Version:

Temperature = Flavor
Wattage = Vapor


Longer Version:

You wan't to set your temp to where your juice vaporizes to your liking. Juice will vaporize at a specific temperature based on its makeup, once it hits that temp adjusting the temp higher can change the taste of the juice and etc. up until the temp the juice turns nasty and harmful. VG and PG vaporize at different temps so there is not really one temp that works for every juice or even a temp that everyone prefers with the same juice. Personal preferences are always different as are builds and etc.

Then wattage can be used to adjust the amount of vapor that is produced. Higher wattage = more vapor....lower = less.

However it has been my experience that it is difficult to build a setup to efficiently achieve this. There are many variables in a setup that can effect all of this and right now I think the TC tech is further ahead of atomizer tech which can not properly take advantage. So right now we basically find a build to suit our liking and adjust both temp and wattage to maximize the build/setup based on our preferences. Slight adjustments can be made with temp and wattage to fine tune, however larger changes are made by changing the build/setup.



I think whoever explained this to you may have done it before the dna200 board.

I like things to be logical . so here is how i see it:-
complicated version

more vapor can only be produced with more power IF and only IF you do not have enough power set initially to maintain the coil at a set temperature.

If you have power set so that once the preheat hits and the target temperature is reached. no matter how much you increase the power you will not get more vapour as the device WILL NOT put that power into the coil as the temperature setting will always adjust the power to keep at the same temp!

below i have a pic from device monitor, the first puff is at 100w and the second is at 60W

as you can see the power delivery is almost identical {so was the amount of vapour)......Why?

because the power curve that was sent to the coil was identical irrespective of power set!


Simple version:-

when using temperature control there is only one constant setting...............temperature!
everything else is a variable in relation to the temperature set!

ie. when you set the temperature  and hit the fire button the temperature goes to and stays at the set temperature.
when you set power and hit the fire button with preheat it exceeds your power setting and when the temperature hits target it is way below your power setting.


conclusion.
I think the power adjustment belongs in the world of regulated non tc mods where i agree more power more vapour!

the only purpose of using power on a tc device is to lower the power to where the coil never quite reaches temperature ( which I have used to great effect. see my posts on SS) which can give a more consistent vape especially with SS.



Attached Images
jpeg power_adjust.jpg (161.77 KB, 20 views)

Margucci

Senior Member
Registered:
Posts: 117
Reply with quote  #42 
lol that isnt controversial. for anyone who has thought about what is actually happening it is a foregone conclusion. hence, its obvious that while in TC mode the primary adjustment should be temperature (or at least have the option to be). 
r4nd0m

Junior Member
Registered:
Posts: 13
Reply with quote  #43 
Well, from what I see there are two camps here - I would suggest a TC best practices threat to explain how to do it "properly" or "intended" with this device.

I have been playing a lot lately and reading this thread explained many things I was experiencing but still keeps questions unanswered which means the instructions aren't clear enough - I don't mind being blamed for being lazy but when searching the web you'll find both camps all the time spaced vs contact coils for NI, Ti, SS or watts vs temperature ... would be nice if the developers would tell people how the device and software has been designed to work best or at least how they intend people to use it with an explanation why ... I can see some points in this thread but again I think a clear explanation would help so people use it how it has been designed and it woods as expected ... This surely would open up the conversation for comments and hopefully will be helpful for all of us.

Just a friendly comment ...

with regards to scrum do it, we do it for quite some time and it has improved the ability to introduce new features much quicker - agile development is anyhow better especially if you are able to release feature builds vs full builds that require full QA ...

lewisss

Senior Member
Registered:
Posts: 139
Reply with quote  #44 
Quote:
Originally Posted by r4nd0m
Well, from what I see there are two camps here - I would suggest a TC best practices threat to explain how to do it "properly" or "intended" with this device. I have been playing a lot lately and reading this thread explained many things I was experiencing but still keeps questions unanswered which means the instructions aren't clear enough - I don't mind being blamed for being lazy but when searching the web you'll find both camps all the time spaced vs contact coils for NI, Ti, SS or watts vs temperature ... would be nice if the developers would tell people how the device and software has been designed to work best or at least how they intend people to use it with an explanation why ... I can see some points in this thread but again I think a clear explanation would help so people use it how it has been designed and it woods as expected ... This surely would open up the conversation for comments and hopefully will be helpful for all of us. Just a friendly comment ... with regards to scrum do it, we do it for quite some time and it has improved the ability to introduce new features much quicker - agile development is anyhow better especially if you are able to release feature builds vs full builds that require full QA ...


lol, start a spaced vs contact vs clapton in temperature control thread and i will happily give you my theories on that!
r4nd0m

Junior Member
Registered:
Posts: 13
Reply with quote  #45 
That's not the idea just saying there will always be two camps but as a manufacturer you should be able to clearly state how the device or software you produce should be used and possibly even give some detail with it - helps for sure [smile]
Previous Topic | Next Topic
Print
Reply

Quick Navigation:

Easily create a Forum Website with Website Toolbox.